What an Odd Day

[queenoftheskies]

It stormed today. Really cool. Reminds me of Nashville weather.

Work is getting scarier...in many respects. Got attacked verbally today by a really scary fellow who was mad because I wasn't a Bush supporter. Told me that torture and murder were the US's right. Told me we needed to wipe other people out. Told me the people who didn't have jobs here in the US needed to be weeded out and destroyed...survival of the fittest. And, that he supported Bush so all this could happen. The guy already creeped me out...he's new...now it's worse.

Finances at work are worse. Owner keeps spending more money, writing more bad checks. Sigh...will it never end?

Beginning of the End 1161 words today

141,379 total words to date

Maybe I'm coming to terms a little with the fact that I can edit and change later and that it's good to get things down. At least for today. :)

Comments

[kimberlychapman.livejournal.com]

1) Yup, that Bush supporter sounds creepy. Around where I live, I've seen bumper stickers that say "Nuke their ass, take their gas." Happy, happy world, eh? >:P

2) It's very comforting for me to see another writer who writes long. My first novel came out around 182,000 after editing (427 pages). None of the readers or reviewers seem to mind the length, though. My philosophy as a writer is this: I'm not going to gloss over important details just to reduce word count. I like reading a complete story, so giving my readers anything less would be hypocritical.

My latest work is a veritable tome at 330,000 words, so I expect any publisher that takes it to want to split it into two volumes (although I'd be thrilled if they didn't!). As an experiment I cut out every conversation and scene that wasn't integral to the plot (i.e. mostly character development stuff and seeded information for sequels). I managed to cut almost 20,000 words, but that still made it over 300,000, so then I was left with a much crappier book that was still quite long.

See, I have this way of writing in twisted cause-and-effect chains that means if an editor kills one part, other parts make no sense. *shrug* Like I said, the readers seem to dig it!

So don't beat yourself up too much about length. Sure, lots of publishers won't even touch it if it's longer than their submission guidelines say, but some will. Look at Neil Stephenson's Baroque Cycle series...those are HUGE and they're selling quite well! :)

[queenoftheskies.livejournal.com]

Sheesh! These Bush supporters are frightening, aren't they? I just can't imagine viewing the world that way. But, then, the freak at work told me it was because I was too soft and that only the toughest survived.

So, I looked at him (he's 25) and I said, if I'm so soft, how have I survived as a single parent for 9-1/2 years and gone from the welfare that my ex had me on to being Controller for an aerospace company, taking care of three kids the entire time with no child support, and now even putting one through college?

He, of course, had no response except that, "Oh, well I didn't say YOU were soft."

Then he tells me that the unemployed people who can't get jobs are just being weeded out cause it's survival of the fittest and I pointed out to him that he'd been unemployed and the only reason he has his job (which he's only had for a few months) is because he has a sister who loves him (and used to work for our company) who got him the job.

He, of course, didn't think that had anything to do with anything.

Oh, it's a relief to hear from another writer who likes to write long novels. There's just always so much to include, I feel, in order to tell the story PROPERLY. I guess I could condense some, and I know I'll lose page count when I edit, but I hate to skimp, when I can write the entire thing, you know?

I've heard that first novels should be under 100,000, so maybe that's going to cause me trouble. I don't know. But, I guess the trick will be getting read in the first place.

I just bought a fantasy novel yesterday that's 764 pages. I LOVE long novels personally.

[kimberlychapman.livejournal.com]

But, then, the freak at work told me it was because I was too soft and that only the toughest survived.

Ah. Ask him if he uses roads to drive, and if he says yes, suggest that government paid-for roads are a cushy element of modern living and that if he was a REAL MAN he'd drive on plain dirt like in the good ol' days. :)

if I'm so soft, how have I survived as a single parent for 9-1/2 years and gone from the welfare that my ex had me on to being Controller for an aerospace company, taking care of three kids the entire time with no child support, and now even putting one through college?

You sound like a liberal, pot-smoking slacker to me. ;)

This guy sounds like an ass. You're a good person to even indulge him. I know the feeling, though...you just want to make these people wake up and smell the class dichotomy, don't you? *sigh*

Oh, it's a relief to hear from another writer who likes to write long novels. There's just always so much to include, I feel, in order to tell the story PROPERLY. I guess I could condense some, and I know I'll lose page count when I edit, but I hate to skimp, when I can write the entire thing, you know?

Why do you think I came commenting on your journal? I was relieved to see I'm not the only one either! :D And I'm 100% with you on not skimping. Sure, writing can be made tighter when it's done well, and my awesome and beloved editor for my first novel helped me do that. She also found places where I needed to explain things further, so I think it was a zero sum game on the word count overall.

I get that publishers have narrow margins and adding pages without increasing the price beyond what consumers will pay eats into publisher profits, but I also believe that selling crappy short books won't make up the difference! I believe strongly in letting a book be the length it needs to be, which means not padding out small ones and not grossly cutting back long ones. I never set out with a word count in mind; I tell a story and see where it goes.

I'm hoping that my latest work will get picked up by a REAL publisher this time (not the POD stuff I've been dealing with with my first novel). It's submitted now to one of our household's favourite publishers (we must own at least one hundred of their books, if not more). It's longer than their submission guidelines say but I'm hoping they'll see the book's potential anyway.

Then I'm going to try to turn it into a screenplay and launch my pie-in-the-sky dream of having Anthony LaPaglia play the lead role. got any good screenplay writing advice? :)

[queenoftheskies.livejournal.com]

But, you know what sucks about publishers and length? If you're a first time writer, I hear that it's really hard to get anything over 100,000 words published. Isn't that ridiculous? I think it should be based solely on quality of work, and not on word count.

Now, I'm expecting my novel to drop word count, maybe drastically, once I start editing. But, for now, I'm trying really hard not to freak out as it approaches 150,000 words.

Personally, I ADORE long novels. That's one thing that makes me purchase a novel that looks good, as a matter of fact. I read mostly fantasy (though I like horror lots and well-done sci-fi) and how can you get into a world the author created in a short book? I want to see expanded, know everything they're willing to share with me.

As far as screenwriting goes, the first advice most screenwriters give is to read screenplays...many screenplays. There are lots of sites that post them for education purposes and I can suggest some, if you like.

Some of the important things to remember is that the structure is rigid and you must stick to it...same with length. They must range 90-120 pages. Agents and production company execs are unforgiving in this. Certain genres have certain restrictions in addition to the general guideline.

There's also a set three-act structure. You can't expound in exposition. Can't show things from the character's point of view.

Hmm...anything in particular you'd like to know?

[kimberlychapman.livejournal.com]

If you're a first time writer, I hear that it's really hard to get anything over 100,000 words published. Isn't that ridiculous?

Yes it is, although for a first timer it's hard anyway. I did get mine looked at eventually! :)

I read mostly fantasy (though I like horror lots and well-done sci-fi) and how can you get into a world the author created in a short book? I want to see expanded, know everything they're willing to share with me.

Yeah, me too! Short books are okay but often leave me wanting more if they're any good. Terry Pratchett's shortish books are okay because it's a series that continues in the next book. If you like fantasy, you ought to like him...he does comedic fantasy, often poking fun at normal fantasy and Shakespeare and stuff like that. Brilliant work.

As far as screenwriting goes, the first advice most screenwriters give is to read screenplays...many screenplays. There are lots of sites that post them for education purposes and I can suggest some, if you like.

Ooo, yes, please do! I've been looking for stuff like that, actually, to little or no avail.

Those are good tips, thanks. I'm hoping the book will do so well that people *want* to make the movie (which is quite a pie-in-the-sky dream, I know). My problem then is knowing what to do with the screenplay once it's done, especially since I don't want to just hand it over to anybody. I want to retain at least some creative control and I want Anthony LaPaglia to play the lead role. Everything else, including money, is extremely negotiable. :)

And yes I know that this is all very unrealistic!